[spectre] Dispatches from Ukraine: Tactical Media Reflflections and Responses

Sun Jul 17 10:57:17 CEST 2022

heath

I am sorry, but your messages don't make any sense, they are full of 
"jumbled thoughts", or may be my English is not sophisticated enough but 
I don't get your point,

may I make it bit more clear here - that since the Feb 24, 2022 (war in 
Ukraine started) there are basically only two sides - either you support 
Ukraine's fight to get free from Russia's occupants, or you accept that 
Putin's Russia can go on and take the dominance, continuing to use their 
worst and most cynical war methods against civilians in Ukraine - now, 
and later in other countries.. (they will never stop, as they never have 
enough - not only many experts say so, but also my personal experience - 
of living my first 20 years in my life in Russia's occupied Latvia).

there is no other third way, as this is not a democratic country we deal 
with, it's based on lies, it always was, and these lies are very 
different ones than those in your 'bad' capitalist countries, because 
they are really dangerous, 'imperialistic' (as you say) and 
chauvinistic, they make other nations they occupy lesser than them, and 
make other world to believe their 'cultures' are bigger and better, 
while our (other Eastern European, and former occupied countries) voices 
then have always been shut up, you were used to call us "rusophobs", 
which is totally not the case and never was, many of my best friends are 
Russians.

 > can we not leave nation states to fight it out between themselves ?

of course not! the 'nice' Western people already for too long have 
accepted Russia's Kremlin propaganda and their hybrid media wars as in 
Baltics, never taking too seriously, and again calling us Rusophobes, 
Western countries were always shutting us up when our governments gave 
the serious warnings in various (especially recent ones) European meetings.

so either you listen bit more carefully what the other nations who have 
been under long occupation think of the war in Ukraine and Russia as 
country,

or you can try yourself to visit Russia and try to figure out what the 
140 million people there really think..

or, move to Latvia, if you really want to understand and personally 
experience how does it feel to live just 200 km from the border of the 
big threatening country, who already occupied us once. it is here very 
different feeling to be here - as Latvia (which is rather poor country) 
is hosting 40 000 refugees from Ukraine, where my friends are delivering 
jeep cars privately to the Ukraine to help them (while other pacifistic 
Western European countries deny or delay their military support), and we 
do this because at least 30% by official statistics believe that we will 
be next... (sooner or later).

so any, even the most tiniest expression or sign of a help or support 
such as an art residency or writing activist project, supporting 
Ukrainian position is worth it, because it is a simply a humanistic act, 
so much needed, as their hearts and lives are broken no matter if they 
have escaped, but they are aware of that in their country Russian 
militarists continue to kill and rape...

so while pacifism has long way to be achieved, there are humans and 
their lives that need any support or a sign of any solidarity now...

any critical skepticism towards those who do something is the least needed.

Jaanis sent you great sources, you better read them first before 
questioning, if they are trustful enough for you.

and last but not least, I also can share my own 'jumbled thoughts' by 
referring to Manovich's post in FB, when he said that please consider 
that many people (especially young ones) in Russia would prefer to live 
in your "rotten" capitalist system. So am I, as I have experienced both 
- communist and capitalist governments. And here I am largely suspicious 
about your pacifistic ideas, as well as other UK's May 1st Day activist 
ambivalent intents (how I call them - marxists with Porsche): may be you 
simply don't want countries like Ukraine, Moldova, Georgia, etc. to 
share with your capitalist "goods" and people achieving just to live 
their normal lives?

best

Rasa

On 16/07/2022 14:49, heath bunting wrote:
> jaanis
>
> thanks for links - will take a look - not hopeful for making
> good decision on these though, as it takes years of careful scrutiny
> to determine whether sources are reliable and not mouthpieces for 
> in-tell agencies
>
> why does russian state propaganda matter to grass roots activists ?
>
> i would have thought super-state propaganda vs sub-state propaganda is 
> more relevant
>
> can we not leave nation states to fight it out between themselves ?
>
> overwhelming evidence suggestions that unlawful trans-national 
> entities such as empires (united state of america empire: USAE) are a 
> greater threat to individuals/ humanity than lawfully constituted 
> nation states
>
> what's more of a threat to peace ? 1000 foreign USAE military bases or
> 2 russian foreign military bases ?
>
> hope all is well
>
> heath
>
>
> On Sat, 16 Jul 2022, jg at 21.x-i.net wrote:
>
>> Most of your questions about importance of fighting russian state 
>> propaganda can be answered by these expert resources:
>>
>>
>> https://meduza.io/en/feature/2022/03/08/meduza-is-granting-open-access-to-all-content-about-the-war-in-ukraine-under-a-creative-commons-license 
>>
>>
>> https://meduza.io/en/feature/2022/07/12/meduza-is-hiring-a-social-media-editor-for-its-english-language-edition 
>>
>>
>> https://theconversation.com/russias-disappearing-independent-media-why-they-closed-178590 
>>
>>
>> https://netzpolitik.org/2020/russian-disinformation-the-network-of-fake-foreign-media/ 
>>
>>
>> https://euvsdisinfo.eu/report/the-war-in-ukraine-is-about-the-reunification-of-the-russian-people2 
>>
>>
>> The Russian neo-Nazis fighting Vladimir Putin’s war to ‘denazify’ 
>> Ukraine
>> https://meduza.io/en/feature/2022/07/15/dying-to-kill
>>
>>
>>
>> List of few independent  resources in Russian..
>>
>> https://www.youtube.com/c/Popularpolitics
>> https://www.youtube.com/c/NevzorovTV
>> https://www.youtube.com/c/FeyginLive
>> https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCzaqqlriSjVyc795m86GVyg
>> https://www.youtube.com/c/Gordonua
>>
>>
>>
>> On 16/07/2022 11:03, heath bunting wrote:
>>> geert
>>>
>>>> supporting Ukrainian media and confronting Russian state propaganda.
>>>
>>> these aims appear to be very aligned to imperial interests
>>>
>>> what do you mean by ukrainian media ? state/ corporate or grass roots ?
>>>
>>> why is it important to confront russian state propaganda ?
>>>
>>> who is at risk of this messaging ?
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